"Girls aren't good at math."
The overwhelming majority of people I interact with would find that to be a ridiculous and inappropriate statement. Some girls and women excel at all things mathematical while others struggle with varying success, just like other endeavors. The assumption that because a person is female, she must not have the mathematical aptitude of her male peers is, thankfully, not something I encounter often from people I talk to on a regular basis.
It's interesting, then, that I do hear things like these:
"Guys don't have feelings."
"Boys are slobs."
"Pfft, men only half listen when you talk to them."
And nobody really bats an eye. Except for a couple weeks ago, when I did. I tried to be polite about it, but it still felt a little awkward.
Why is it socially acceptable for women to make disparaging generalizations about men, when the reverse -- which, yes, also happens -- usually causes an uproar? It's a double standard, and that's not fair.
More importantly (because sometimes "that's not fair, so do the right thing" can be a tough message to internalize) disparaging men based on stereotypes won't fix anything. If statements like "men only half listen" stem from women's frustration about behavior of men that they've encountered -- and I suspect that's the case -- I fail to see how generalizations like that do anything to fix it. Chalking frustrating behavior to up "oh, that's just how they are" only perpetuates the problem, right?
Sure, there are plenty of men who aren't good listeners. There are lots of women in that category, too. But if it's generally accepted that men aren't good listeners, because oh, you know, that's just how they are... well, guess what? Men who don't listen well will just keep on keepin' on not listening well. That can't be the end goal for women who get upset when the men around them don't pay attention. If there's a wish for men to be better listeners, partners, husbands, and parents (and really, such a wish would be integral to ensuring equal opportunities for men and women, no?) maybe a better way to achieve that goal would be to expect more from them and assume capability, rather than setting bar at the lowest common denominator.
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16 comments:
I totally agree with that! I am a complete feminist, but I believe that men have just as much right to be emotional, loving people as I have the right to be a tough, no-non-sense woman.
Exactly! And I don't think those things are mutually exclusive at all; hopefully anyone who identifies as a feminist would also agree that men can and should be encouraged to be emotional, loving people.
Yes, yes. I have a real like-hate relationship with feminist blogs like Jezebel for this very reason. While posting a constant stream of Hot Naked Men stories, the writers and commenters will become enraged at similar conduct from male counterparts. I don't care who is objectifying or generalizing whom, in either direction, it only hurts us all.
I married a (male) neat freak who listens well and is extremely sensitive. Whenever I hear these comments, I bat them back with, "that's not true in my house" or "not all men" or "that's not fair." I think once it becomes a knee-jerk reaction and you're light about it - sometimes I say, "clearly you've never met my husband", people will redact and say, "some men are slobs" which, while still a generalization, is also true.
Sarah, I don't read a lot of Jezebel, but yeah, I would take issue with that for sure. My thinking is that if something analogous were offensive to me and women in general and I'd appreciate my husband saying something, then I should stand up for him and men.
Ellie, that's a great tactic. I used something similar recently and I was a little concerned about sounding like I was bragging about my husband. The competitive mindset of, well, our entire society, but particularly the way we think about relationships is it's own special brand off messed up, so I should probably let that one go.
Is this your thinking post?
I have to say, it really annoys me when my mom says "It's a man thing" about whatever annoying behavior my Dad/husband/BIL has. Like you said, that's not fair, and even if it is true, it allows them to get away with that bad behavior because of their sex. Not right.
And men do have feelings! I know, because I've hurt my man's feelings before, unintentionally, of course.
Yep, L, this is the Thinking Post I was talking about.
The "it's a man thing" stuff is so annoying, and it seems like it's everywhere. You're right, they shouldn't get a pass because they're guys. Annnd, to be fair, I shouldn't get a pass on traditionally male responsibilities because I'm female. I suppose I should learn more about how to keep our cars in good shape. Double standards can be tempting to fall back on.
... Hmmm, I guess I should say "stereotypyes" can be tempting to fall back on.
Interesting timing. I made an offhand comment to a friend yesterday that was intended to show solidarity with men who would like a more emotional/soft skill framework for their gender, but can't find one and she heard it as a sexist comment. I was a little taken aback, but then spent some time with her mom later in the evening and SHE seemed to be on a nonstop sexist rant, so I figured that's where the sensitivity was coming from.
All that to say I agree with you, despite my own tendency toward sexism. I will love it when I stop being surprised by men who are positively emotional, curious and loving people. Thank goodness for the likes of you pointing them out to me by marrying them! :D
:-D Happy to oblige, Andria!
The "men don't have feelings" thing really bugs me too. I've (unintentionally) hurt the feelings of several men I care about over the years, and some of them are instances I still feel guilty about.
I think a lot of what it comes down to is, in general, men and women often communicate differently. In general, men solve problems. In general, women talk it out. In general, men often show they care by doing something for you. In general, women often show they care by telling you so. None of these are wrong (and none of them are 100% male or 100% female...I know I am a "doer" and often a "problem solver") but I think it leads to the "men don't have feelings and women are overly emotional" stereotypes.
So good for you for standing up for your awesome husband and knocking down some of the stereotypes!
Thanks, Kate! You make a really good point with the doing versus saying concept. It can indeed be a challenge to remember that people have different ways of expressing their emotions. I also think, though, that sometimes the "guys don't have feelings" thing is partially a matter of convenience. Not entirely, of course, but sometimes it's easier for folks not have to take someone else's feelings into accoint, and if that someone else doesn't really *have* feelings to speak of...
On the other hand, I think you can fit into traditional stereotypes as long as you don't make it about the stereotype. I don't like cars either -- I have a slight interest in fixing them myself, but that's only because I like fixing things and I like saving money. As for car types/general interest, well, I can only tell it's a Toyota if it says "Toyota" on the tailgate. But when I talk about that, I never say "I'm a woman, we know nothing about cars", I say "I really don't give a crap about cars". For the record, neither does my husband. So whatever, I'm a woman who doesn't like cars, but I don't dislike cars because I'm a woman.
Apply all this in reverse (say, men and baking or rom-coms) and it will be relevant to your post. :)
Right, I agree with you for the most part, L. I definitely have no interest in cars as any sort of hobby or recreation.... BUT, as a person who drives a car, I should probably be at least marginally aware of the oil, tire pressure, how to fix a flat, etc., both so that I'll be ok if I need to address something by myself, and so The Awesome Husband doesn't have to pick up all the slack. He handles most of that stuff currently and doesn't mind doing so, but that doesn't make it fair.
To use one of your other examples, baking, not every man or woman has to enjoy baking, but to some extent, I think being able to follow a recipe is just a good skill for grown-ups to have. So for those grown-ups who don't bake much because they don't enjoy it, that's fine, but the ones who are male shouldn't be excused from, say, ever helping with family birthday cakes just because it isn't a "guy thing."
Does that make sense? I might be getting too mired in analogous examples. :)
It's funny because I'm guilty of making those comments sometimes, even though the man that I married is the complete opposite. So really, when I say things that disparage the whole male gender, I'm completely talking out my ass because my husband isn't like that, nor is my dad. I think it's something I picked up talking to girlfriends about their own men-folk. I shouldn't let the bad ones color my perception of the good ones, especially when I do my best to surround myself with the good ones.
Yeah, since I started paying more attention to it, I realized how prevalent it is. And it's super easy to get sucked in, especially when you're talking to a group of women, even if logically you know the men in your life don't fit that description.
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